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Author Topic: Sort it out burper!  (Read 5954 times)
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scardy
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« on: August 09, 2004, 12:41:26 PM »

[6th june]"With a big tournament ,we need to be excrutiatingly detailed"[burper]
Why then run a bagolympic session if you cant carry out the above?

1.The very 1st line in the rules of bago says, registration will take place 30 minutes prior to the start.Not 5 minutes!I believe this gives you the TD time to sort out any problems,recieve the country of the players leaving them with no doubt to what is going on!

2.It would be a good idea to mention in shouts ,that the tourney you are running is the bagolympics.
I may be wrong but have never seen "Friday 3's being just called single elimination without the reference to the tourney title.
Last night was a farce with players missing the session due to poor management.Indeed,a player with one of the best records in bago missed because of the confusion.His first language isnt English,but he would have been ok if points 1 and 2 (above )had been adhered to.
This is a shame because of the excellent work done by tomawacky(brilliant stats)and Eddie Vedd for the next stage,diane for giving up sleep to help the austrailians get involved,not forgetting Mano and gogogiz for giving up there time also.
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burper
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« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2004, 02:02:05 PM »

scardy is right, I did not do this session justice.

I had family matters to attend to during the registration time. I did manage to get the tourney opened on time, 30 minutes before the start. I thought I had the title right, but it was the description instead. I rushed it. I thought with the right title it would be announced correctly, but I goofed.

I think the 5 minutes scardy refers to is the time I managed to get back and attend to signups. His questions about BagO being single elimination confused me (I had to double  check the page in case someone changed it on me).

In any case, I apologize to scardy, and mrbond who I think also missed the signup. And to dorbel, who was also confused. juanz was confused, but I think he showed up too late as well. Mort managed to get in, but agreed that not enough announcing was done. And a big sorry to anyone else who missed. 19 players did manage to get in based on the clues:

-it was the right place and time for BagO
-it had the right TD running it
-it had the right matchlenths
-the description of the tourney stated that it was BagO and even what session it was
-the shouts 5 minutes prior to start, while confusing, should have cleared the issue up

advice for players:
-rather than ask others about BagO, please look over the official BagO page:
http://fibsleagammon.free.fr/bagolympic.htm
 It even has the official clock upon which open and start times, as well as forfeit times are based.
-learn some of the basic tourneybot commands to get more information about a tourney, in particular "tourney N", which will include the match lengths, limits, description etc...

advice for Tomawaky and other TD's of BagO:
-maybe we need to state some announcing rules. A shout every 5 minutes during registration, to specifically include the term "BagOlympic", and a title for the tourney that also includes it.

Bottom line: I thought I would have enough time to TD a BagO session once a month, but apparently I don't. Well, not enough to do this great tournament justice. So, Tomawaky: please find a replacement for my Sunday after second Tuesday 9pm GMT slot.

I also would like to nominate both dorbel and scardy as TD's, in particular for the BagO sessions. Their passion for this tournament and attention to detail would make them excellent moderators! No, I am not being sarcastically belligerent, you guys really know how the TD position should be run.

But I do have a question for scardy: since you managed to register for tourney 93, and you knew eventually that it was in fact the BagO session, why did you not play your round 1 match against diane? I've been honest, now you be.
 
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« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2004, 02:02:05 PM »

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scardy
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« Reply #2 on: August 09, 2004, 04:17:44 PM »

By the time i realised it was the bago i toggled ready only to be dissqualified within a minute.I said to you i was nt going to play unless it was bagolimpics.And had both you and diane (who is my team mate and a fellow northener:-))sending me messages.i could see the confusion in shouts.and wished i'd never bothered.As it was my country got no points last night, and that isnt ever what i want.We have'nt many players taking part, and dont have the luxury of an abundence of players as your's does.btw the complaint to repbot was petty    
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burper
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« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2004, 04:24:11 PM »

You have my sincere apology, my resignation as BagO TD and I have withdrawn my complaint. At the time, with all your confusing shouts, I thought you were intentionally trying to disrupt the tourney. Be aware that at the start of a tourney, a TD is very busy trying to sort things out.

I have also noticed that dorbel did in fact make it in to this session, only to lose in the first round. This makes me wonder what all his complaints were about? But I guess trying to beg forgiveness for what I thought was pretty minor transgressions is being "belligerent". Nevermind,  you are both good, and I am bad. You are right and I am wrong.
 
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scardy
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« Reply #4 on: August 09, 2004, 05:05:35 PM »

I am sorry to hear that you have resigned as TD in the bagolympics.As i said last night i didnt want to complain but could see the confusion in shouts.Yes an excellent recommendation to announce every 5 minutes or so in registration.also may i suggest that it only need be the first time playing in the bago's that a player need tell there country as the excellent stats make this quiet clear although this may mean more time spent on it for tomawaky(sorry),but would give the TD's more time for other queries.I know you already give up your time for the enjoyment of others here on fibs,so please keep it up.  
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burper
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« Reply #5 on: August 09, 2004, 05:14:10 PM »

I think tourneybot can be improved so that some of the messaging can be automated. I'll take a look at that.
I didn't see a convenient place to get players/countries.
Again, I am sorry that 4 BagO TD's could not resolve your confusion in time.
Does your latest reply imply that you are not volunteering for TD duty?
« Last Edit: August 09, 2004, 05:25:50 PM by burper » Logged
dorbel
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« Reply #6 on: August 09, 2004, 05:29:47 PM »

Burper tells us that he goofed, but unable to leave it there, goes on to point out that he really did it alright. We should have known that it was Bagolympics because it had the right director". Actually no burper, it was listed as being diane.
"The description of the Tournament stated that it was Bagolympics and even what session it was". No it didn't. The 30 minute call for registration and the 5 minute call both mentioned only that this was Tourney No 93 or some such. There was no mention of Bagolympics there, as burper actually acknowledges in another part of his post! "The confusing shouts in the 5 minutes prior to starting should have cleared things up". ROFL
 When it was pointed out to burper, by myself and others, that an indication in shouts that the upcoming tourney was a Bagolympic qualifier might have netted a larger entry, his responses and those of diane who had by now arrived were sadly defensive, innaccurate and discourteous. Their sarcastic tones fell far short of the standard to which TDs should aspire. Burper now says that he thought we were intentionally trying to disrupt the tourney! The substance of my complaint was that constructive criticism was offered and it engendered a negative and defensive response. I don't see why the fact that I had in fact followed the trail of clues and entered should invalidate my rights to point out disturbing organisational flaws,
Burper's breathtaking effrontery to offer advice to all and sundry in the same letter that he is resigning is fairly typical of the man, as is his rushing to RepBot with a complaint rather than attempting to put things right.
Finally I am very flattered to be nominated as a TD, rather in the regal style of a departing monarch choosing his successor. Sadly I must refuse this crown, as I only take on responsibilities if able to devote to them my full time and energies.
Burper would be well advised in future to adopt the same policy.
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burper
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« Reply #7 on: August 09, 2004, 05:52:53 PM »

Quote
Burper tells us that he goofed, but unable to leave it there, goes on to point out that he really did it alright.
I did? Where? I guess you can interpret things any way you like, especially when you leave out the facts.

Quote
We should have known that it was Bagolympics because it had the right director". Actually no burper, it was listed as being diane.
Um, no, actually it was listed as burper. Again, state the facts, or at least cite them.
And that was not the only "clue" I listed, but leave out the parts that don't fit with your argument.
It was the right time and place, moderator, and had the correct matchlengths and other settings, AND the description stated CLEARLY that it was BagO.

Quote
"The description of the Tournament stated that it was Bagolympics and even what session it was". No it didn't.
Yes, it did. Here it is again for you:
TBot says: Displaying information about Tourney 93:
>
TBot says: |93: [bracket] Single Elimination Bracket Tourney #93| |Sun, 08 Aug 04 18:16 UTC| |Directors: burper| |Status: Completed|
>
TBot says: Min players: 4 Max players: 128 Registered players: 19 (tourney completed)
>
TBot says: Match length: 3 Match length finals: 5
>
TBot says: Limits: (no limits)
>
TBot says: Description: bagolympic sunday after first tuesday session
>
TBot says: Done displaying information on Tourney 93.

Quote
The 30 minute call for registration and the 5 minute call both mentioned only that this was Tourney No 93 or some such. There was no mention of Bagolympics there, as burper actually acknowledges in another part of his post!
Amazing!! I am telling the truth.

Quote
"The confusing shouts in the 5 minutes prior to starting should have cleared things up". ROFL
There were 4 BagO TD's present. The issue was discussed. Both you and scardy managed to get in.
Fact is, you don't like me, and you will pursue this huge issue vigorishly all day.

Quote
When it was pointed out to burper, by myself and others, that an indication in shouts that the upcoming tourney was a Bagolympic qualifier might have netted a larger entry, his responses and those of diane who had by now arrived were sadly defensive, innaccurate and discourteous. Their sarcastic tones fell far short of the standard to which TDs should aspire. Burper now says that he thought we were intentionally trying to disrupt the tourney!
Well, if you're going to talk about "tone", let me say that both scardy and you were quite rude and took an attacking tone. diane and myself kept stating the facts over and over and over.
I believe you are turning a molehill into a mountain, for personal reasons.

Quote
The substance of my complaint was that constructive criticism was offered
BS, there was nothing constructive about it. It was all accusing. Some people love to jump all over the tiniest "flaws" in  free services. Why is that?

Quote
and it engendered a negative and defensive response.
BS. As stated before, 19 people managed to enter and enjoy the tourney. How many times does one  answer the same question before your answers are considered belligerent?

Quote
I don't see why the fact that I had in fact followed the trail of clues and entered should invalidate my rights to point out disturbing organisational flaws,
Disturbing?
You have my resignation dorbel, what do you want now, blood?
I had said I was sorry, and said you were right and I was wrong. Rather than leave it there...

Quote
Burper's breathtaking effrontery to offer advice to all and sundry in the same letter that he is resigning is fairly typical of the man,
Breathtaking! Smiley
Typical of the man? Clearly you have no other agenda than to improve the quality of BagO. Smiley
The advice is sound, and not effronting to anyone but you, because you choose to take it that way.
If there is any confusion, those that are empathetic to the hectic state of a TD at the beginning of a session and have the resourcefulness and open mindedness to take the advice, should list the tournament specs thusly:
tell tourneybot tourney <NUM>
or in this case
tell tbot to 93

It's bound to be quicker and more accurate than shouting complaints, and less effronting to you.

Quote
Finally I am very flattered to be nominated as a TD, rather in the regal style of a departing monarch choosing his successor. Sadly I must refuse this crown,
I guess people get the points they want to get, and twist the others around to fit their agenda.
It's not a crown, it's a pain-in-the-ass position when there are people out to attack you.
It's sad that you can't just play the tournaments and enjoy them without ridiculing others.

Quote
as I only take on responsibilities if able to devote to them my full time and energies.
Burper would be well advised in future to adopt the same policy.
Umm, thus the resignation. duh.
I only wish I had half the time to devote to BagO as you have in attacking me.
« Last Edit: August 09, 2004, 06:06:09 PM by burper » Logged
diane
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« Reply #8 on: August 09, 2004, 06:50:13 PM »

OK, where to begin with this??

Lets see - a good place is ...
Quote
Burper tells us that he goofed, but unable to leave it there, goes on to point out that he really did it alright. We should have known that it was Bagolympics because it had the right director". Actually no burper, it was listed as being diane.

Although burper has corrected this erroneous fact - I will mention it too - since there seems to a general mistrust of anything he says.  It was not my session, mine takes place two weeks from last night, and I would be delighted to see you all there again - as usual  Wink

Quote
diane who had by now arrived

Since it was not my night - I was occupied with household stuff - to the point I almost missed it myself - so yes - I was at the last minute.  However, with only one minute to go - I got the number, was surprised to see nothing in the title about BagOlympics, so i did a quick 'tourney 93', got all the info - the matchlengths were right - and the description clearly stated what it was - so i registered (in one minute - not 30). I appreciate as a TD I have a better handle on using the bot than some of the people who only use it to enter tourneys - but even so - it didnt take much doing.

I had missed all the previous goings on - and had no idea why scardy was reluctant to start the match - so I was trying to find out and getting some very odd answers. Scardy was in some doubt as to whether it was the BG tournament - so I clearly stated that this was it - and that we should play.  Still nothing, so I was simply trying to find out what all the fuss was about - and if my approach seemed wrong in the moment - I am sorry - I REALLY did not know there was a problem of any description, but whatever, I most certainly did not use any of this....

Quote
defensive, innaccurate and discourteous. Their sarcastic tones

What is also odd is that I had been on fibs running tourneys most of the afternoon and had mentioned BagOlympics on several occasions - it was discussed a few times as we worked out if yesterday was the right day etc - so most of the regulars were well aware that it would be taking place. Now, whilst in an ideal world, that information would come from the TD, sometimes this place is far from ideal - but it is, i like to think, a community.  So why was everyone so  mistrustful and so unhelpful that people did not know what it was?  I am staggered to find that - but must accept your words since i was not there. All i can say about it after the fact is - what a shame!

But my biggest concern is that we now lost one of a very small number of TDs prepared to run these events.  I have no idea who will replace burper - so there is a good chance the slot will be lost.  I hope this isnt the case and someone will leap forward to the rescue - and hopefully at sometime around midday  Wink

With respect to scardys questions on stating country - i kinda agree and have been trying to find a way to make this job less arduous. Since there is a large amount of work behind the scenes for these tourneys - in preparing the email to report the results for Tomawaky at least. Just to get the results in the format he needs them, to facilitate updating the information on the website, took me well over an hour for the last one - then there is the summary on this site - which i may well stop doing - it is just duplication.  There are many areas here that could be worked on to make this a bit easier - so yes - If there is anyway around this stuff - lets do it  Cheesy

 
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dorbel
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« Reply #9 on: August 09, 2004, 07:15:29 PM »

Oh dear burper, how painful it is to see you so confused.
I took the words "I goofed" from your own post and inferred not unreasonably from the rest of the content that you were then attempting to justify yourself. You weren't you say? Yet you continue to offer the same justifications in your latest post, viz "Um no, it was actually listed as burper". It wasn't and it still isn't if you go to the page listing the tourney times and days!
".........and the description stated clearly that it was Bago" No burper, I triple checked the shout log at the time, right back to the 30 minute announcement, but no hint that tourney 93 was a Bagolympic qualifier ever appeared in shouts. Mort , scardy et al were of the same opinion.
Criticism may appear rude to you burper, as we may again reasonably infer from the tone of your latest post. However, here is a log of the few minutes after the tourney started. I have removed shouts that dont refer to the tourney for clarity. Readers may judge for themselves.
TBot shouts: *** Single Elimination Bracket Tourney #93 (Tourney #93) has just been
started! ***
weaky shouts: welcher laenge?

 
juanz shouts: bagolimpyc number yet??
ROMA_L shouts: still time to play in the tourney?

 
lostoak shouts: burper is missing
burper shouts: it's tbot, not tourneybot
 
scardy shouts: burper its bago night so whats going on with it .does this mean the
listings on fibsboard are wrong
 
 
diane shouts: scardy what are you talking about?Huh?Huh?Huh?Huh?Huh?
burper shouts: scardy, why did you sign up if you don't want to play
diane shouts: check the description on this tourney
 
diane shouts: it is the first sunday after the tuesday
diane shouts: it is 9 o clock utc
diane shouts: burper is hositng
diane shouts: what is wrong?Huh?Huh?Huh?Huh??
burper shouts: scardy, PLEASE, see the bago page for rules!!! http://fibsleagammon.free.fr/bagolympic.htm

scardy shouts: got it burper
diane shouts: scardy says: sorry diane was nt clear
diane shouts: what wasnt clear for crying out loud?Huh?Huh?Huh?Huh??
diane shouts: i told you it was bagolympics
diane shouts: the tourney description says it is bg tourney
Mort shouts: enough already
purol shouts: whats the problem scardy
houtx shouts: thx burper for hosting Smile
burper shouts: yw houtx Smiley

 

TBot shouts: *** Round 1 of Single Elimination Bracket Tourney #93 (Tourney #93)
has been completed! Round winners: NicklasE, diane, fibsterin ***
scardy shouts: not proper announcment of bagolympics .im not the only one who
was unsure
Mort shouts: l agree scardy
scardy shouts: thx mort
Mort shouts: np...l had to ask myself
Mort shouts: and didn't get a resonse
Mort shouts: response
mrbond shouts: I'm with you there scardy
burper shouts: 19 people got it right
diane shouts: i dont understand the confusion
burper shouts: what were you unsure of?

scardy shouts: and 5 mins registration of a comp thats been great fun and one thats
ongoing needs more information
diane shouts: can someone tell me what the problem was?Huh??
You shout: possibly burper, but as the whole point is to be inclusive, a clearer annoncement
would have meant a larger entry
burper shouts: 30 minutes is standard, and that's what it was
scardy shouts: even your msg has no reference to bagoylimpics
burper shouts: clearer about what?
diane shouts: they have been running now for ages
Mort shouts: the tourney wasn't announced in shouts a bagolympic
diane shouts: you all know what it is and when
scardy shouts: sorry but bollocks
burper shouts: http://fibsleagammon.free.fr/bagolympic.htm
burper shouts: the rules are lear
burper shouts: clear
You shout: burper, diane, dont be defensive, learn something, the announcements
were not good and could have been clearer
NIHolympic shouts: theyre lear to
burper shouts: you know who is running it, when by what clock
Mort shouts: why are the TD's collectively being belligerent today?
diane shouts: did you read the tourney description??
diane shouts: first thing i did
burper shouts: belligerent about what? just trying to understand the confusion to be
better next time
Mort shouts: diane, you aren't everyone else
 
burper shouts: what were you unsure of?
diane shouts: TBot: Description: bagolympic sunday after first tuesday session
You shout: Before the tournament started, there was no clear general announcement
that it was a bagolympic event
diane shouts: that kinda says it
mrbond shouts: on "ALL" previous occassions when it has been a bgolympics, it
was clearly stated....
burper shouts: the title title states it is bago
mrbond shouts: this is the first time i have seen it that way
diane shouts: i don t think it is in the title
 
diane shouts: but a little checking sorts it out
diane shouts: and at the right time
scardy shouts: no reference to bagolympics even when you announced the round
winners
diane shouts: with the right host
 
 
baldwin shouts: maybe change the little tittle into a clear tittle

mrbond shouts: but true that we are all aware of times and places regarding bgolympics,
diane n burper
diane shouts: it happens
diane shouts: get used to it
burper shouts: just human nature
You shout: I got in, but some who wanted to play didnt, because it wasnt very clearly
announced.
scardy shouts: sorry diane its a kin joke
burper shouts: info is never in the right format for people, or at the wrong time, or
delivered in the wrong tone
BOTKILLER shouts: i havent read the rules, but judging from the name, i thougth
the tourney was going to last several rounds during the real olympic
You shout: that has to be bad, because it could so easily have been put right.
scardy shouts: we re trying to get people interested in a great concept
burper shouts: then sign up and play scardy. you were signed up. spread the word

You shout: good grief burper, just tell people clearly, is that so hard?
scardy shouts: so get use to it doesnt wear well
burper shouts: good gried, state what was not clear
You shout: what is the point of making a constructive criticism if you are incapable
of making a positive response?
burper shouts: ok, maybe next time I WILL USE ALL CAPS
Shades shouts: what was??... what did I do this time??
burper shouts: no constructive criticism has been made. for the 5th time, WHAT WAS
UNCLEAR
NIHolympic shouts: all caps and smaller words

You shout: What a demonstrably bad attitude from the TD
burper shouts: *sigh*

burper shouts: no answer?
You shout: Is this being run for your benefit burper?
diane shouts: go to las vegas
diane shouts: mine
diane shouts: go to bed
diane shouts: it happens
diane shouts: was what i was saying
scardy shouts: no consistancy at all
You shout: A very poor show all round
scardy shouts: poor show
scardy shouts: Smile
burper shouts: Smiley
 
Judge for yourselves.

IMO burper continues to demonstrate the wisdom of his timely resignation, without appearing to have acquired any degree of self-knowledge in the process. I see that diane is wisely keeping her head down. I thought that her responses (see above) did her no credit either. Perhaps she is more capable of taking constructive criticism (see above) on board.
Mort, scardy, mrbond, juanz, Roma_L and myself are not disruptive children. We found the runup to the tourney confusing and we politely tried to bring this to the attention of the TD and suggest ways in which things could be better managed in the future. We were less than enchanted with the tone and content of the response.
It is true that I don't particularly like burper. He can be counted among the 1% of fibsters that I wouldn't particularly want to be stuck in a lift with. However, I don't approve of personal attacks on fibs and I regret any remarks that may have crossed that line in these two posts. My remarks are intended solely to improve the standard of Fibs tournaments for the benefit of all fibsters. Burpers resignation is IMO, a solid step in the right direction.
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« Reply #10 on: August 09, 2004, 07:22:45 PM »

In fact checking yet again, I now see that the Sunday tournament was indeed listed as burper. My apologies for making and repeating this error, although curiously I wasn't the only one who did so on the night. Perhaps this is yet another page that might be more clearly laid out.
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« Reply #11 on: August 09, 2004, 07:26:44 PM »

Dorbel, maybe you should have a look at your web browser cache.  Wink


 
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« Reply #12 on: August 09, 2004, 08:07:58 PM »

Quote
I see that diane is wisely keeping her head down.

Dont understand that - sorry!

The shouts are pretty much as it went - and as you can see - my  tone is confused - rather than sarcastic - or even particularly defensive.  This is a difficult medium in which to communicate - and having missed the run up to the start - I felt only frustration at what was happening.  If that comes across as either sarcastic or defensive - it wasnt intended that way.  I like to think when I AM being sarcastic - it is unmissable  Tongue

The shouts you say you have edited to remove non essantial information - so can I just correct a few things ...

Quote
diane shouts: it happens
diane shouts: get used to it

That was not relevant to this discussion (it was a conversation with shades about lousy dice Cheesy )  - and I clarified that a few lines later - which you have removed.

Quote
diane shouts: go to las vegas
diane shouts: mine
diane shouts: go to bed
diane shouts: it happens
diane shouts: was what i was saying

Once again - this was relevant to the other discussion - not the one about the tournament.

Quote
Perhaps she is more capable of taking constructive criticism


No I am dreadful at that - check with don  Tongue

But seriously folks - anytime you have a valid point and approach me with it I will listen.  Had I been there sooner - I would undoubtably have helped out, since burper had other restrictions on his time (that I fully understand) - and, as i said - it is a shame that didnt happen anyway - since apparantly 3 other TDs were present.  Or was it that you all wanted to hear it from burper himself?  I just cant help feeling there was some deliberate misunderstanding - and I dont know why.

The tourney description, just to clarify, is different from the title.  The title was misleading - we have all accepted that - but the information was there, and I shouted it - which you have kindly quoted..

Quote
diane shouts: TBot: Description: bagolympic sunday after first tuesday session

And apology accepted for the mistake on who was running the event. You are quite correct - many find it confusing - hence the afternoon conversations rolleyes  - though i would be hard pushed to see how to improve it - any suggestions?
« Last Edit: August 09, 2004, 08:12:23 PM by diane » Logged

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« Reply #13 on: August 09, 2004, 09:10:40 PM »

A suggestion on how to improve the Bagolympics list of upcoming tournaments? Now I may be able to help you there. Although, as most Fibster's suspect, I spend my days secluded from the world in a distant castle, with only the company of a few hundred aged retainers and a moderate harem, yet even here word has reached us of an innovation called a "calendar". It is a system whereby each year is divided up into 12 periods called months. Each of these months is further subdivided into days and each is numbered. Thus it can be seen that each day of the year has a specific title and the necessity to refer to the first Thursday before Michaelmas or the second Sunday preceding Lammastide (for example) is removed. Call me a foolish visionary if you will, I won't be affronted (or effronted as burper amusingly calls it), but it seems to me that this system may just possibly be suitable for the bagolympics page. Perhaps though, you may wish to continue inviting prospective participants to assemble on the Sunday after the second Tuesday in the month. Under those circumstances, I could see why burper would regard an entry of 19 as being a triumph! A true "World Cup" indeed!
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« Reply #14 on: August 09, 2004, 09:23:39 PM »

There is one of those rare and wonderful things on this site - and many have used it to good effect.  Unfortunately - I am challenged in some areas - and could not get the damn thing to work!!! wacko

I dont know why - but when I tried to enter the details of the weds tourneys - it just wouldn't have it.  So, if someone would be so kind as to either enter the info - or devote a little time to explaining to me how on earth the darn thing works - I will do it.  BUT - if you take a look at the calendar - I am not sure that is much more helpful - just my opinion - but comments please.  Would all the dates/times/directors in there be easier to understand?

The thing I like about Tomawakys version is that it needs no further input - once set up - you know what day of the week it is - and hopefully the rough date - so with a little effort it isnt too difficult to fathom.  As I say, there is really a lot of work in this particular tournament for me - and now I run three of em per month on top of my job, saturdays minis every other week and spot tourneys as and when I can.  Oh yeah and I try to play the odd game of backgammon too! Cheesy

I am not complaining - I volunteered - and I will keep to my commitments - but I am looking for ways to make it less effort (as I am sure we all do with any task), simply because the less time it takes me - the more time I can put into other events.
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« Reply #15 on: August 09, 2004, 09:32:25 PM »

So for the first time EVER a Volunteer Tourney Co-ordinator forgot to shout it was BagOlympics ! Meanwhile he's shown up, placed the fact in the tourney"description" (in addition to the facts on the web page),hosted,collated and posted the results. I suspect any perceived "belligerence" is a result of many months (?years) of voluntary altruistic behaviour whilst fending off attacks from a minority. From what i've read in the shout log the score on this day was pretty even. I feel those prospering from the efforts of others should take some reponsibility for educating themselves in formats/rules and tourneybot commands. If the same time was taken to do so on this occasion, as was spent shouting objections, all could have answered the question for themselves [t tourneybot (tbot) tourney #] .


diane Posted on Aug 9 2004, 08:07 PM
Quote
You are quite correct - many find it confusing - hence the afternoon conversations  - though i would be hard pushed to see how to improve it - any suggestions?

Yes. I've metioned it before on the BagOlympic strand and will re-produce it here. Of course though it would require the Voulteer Tourney Co-ordinators to agree.

Make all the sessions either 8 or 9 pm. Not a mix of both. So people know that every Tuesday and the first 2 Sunday's of the month at 20:00 GMT (or 21:00) it's BagOlympic time.  This consistency would help a great deal as per Friday 3's. Same time - Same Bat channel !  

Again i strongly urge you to change the newly formed Wednesday slots from 00:00 "PM". It has to be either 00:00 or Midnight. Better still make it 1 minute either way for clarity. Having said this i know you are considering a move to the 8 hours away we've talked about but thought it worth mentioning here. While-ever 00:00 PM is posted there will be confusion as to the day little own the time Wink
 
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« Reply #16 on: August 09, 2004, 09:55:45 PM »

Very well - I will email Tomawaky to get the time changed - but if one little fibster, anywhere, comments that 11.59 is a strange time to start a tourney - well - I will not be responsible for the replies  Tongue

I had hoped the clarification would come from the fact that registration starts at 23:30 UTC, but never mind - I just want to be as inclusive as possible - and really didnt expect it to get this complicated  rolleyes

I dont think the start times are the issue with the table on Tomawakys table - (with the exception of mine perhaps) - but just as to what is when - since there are more midweek sessions than weekend ones.  The tuesdays is clear - there is always one on tuesday - but the sundays require some thought.  Once you have worked out what day it is - the time is quite clear. (though I do prefer 24 hour notation for this kind of thing).

And of course I want sundays moved around altogether - now we have some feedback from players.  Remember, when the original sessions were drawn up, Tomawaky had little to go on except when the TDs felt they could manage.  Now I am dreading that changing times confuses matters more - since people have gotten used to them. But fortunately, Tomawaky is an amenable fellow - so we should be ok from that side.
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« Reply #17 on: August 09, 2004, 09:57:20 PM »

This thing has become a huge Russian tragedy. A TD, in a rush, neglets to mention a few trivial details over a Sunday tourney that's been running for weeks.

Dorbel, who had no idea what Bagolympic was til 15 minutes before he played, has emerged as an expert on the subject and conducts a rant that makes me wish for Don.

The TD, after offering a tearful mea culpa, picks up his ball and bat and goes home.

Who needs Dostoeyevski ?

NIHI



 
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Robert J Ebbeler
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« Reply #18 on: August 10, 2004, 06:01:43 PM »

as much as I hate to admit it... NIHILIST has a point : dorbel just loves to put oil on the fire and then step aside and watch... for the logs : even I was aware it was a BagO, I stayed on line to play it... and everyone knows that usually I don't even know whats happening !!

 oops  
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« Reply #19 on: August 10, 2004, 07:50:22 PM »

You think NIHI has a point? Well perhaps, although to be criticised for this by NIHI for this is hilarious isn't it? One of the World's Thinnest Books must be NIHILIST's Positive Contributions to Fibs. However my original points made in shouts, see above, were I feel valid and constructive and politely made. One or more clear announcements, in Caps if that's what it takes, would have left nobody in any doubt that a Bago event was about to start, increased the entry and satisfied everybody. How bad is that?
Privately I have also been told that I shouldn't offer criticism of volunteers if I am not prepared to volunteer myself. It's not a view that I share, but fair enough, I will do some stints as a TD if asked. I await the call eagerly!
 
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