Personal responsibility and FIBS drama

[garp_02]

It is just this sort of thing that I think Patti is trying to get rid of.

Whilst I agree that all of JLF's list deserve some form of punishment, I disagree with people trying to take matters into their own hands.

Let Patti deal with it 

[socksey]

If it is a joke, the point of it isn't clear.

It has to be a joke!  i****** is on the list!    dorbel, diane, and I are not!  

socksey



"Habit is habit, and not to be flung out of the window by any man, but
coaxed downstairs a step at a time." - TWAIN

[PersianLord]

Introducing the JLF - The Justice League of Fibsters

The JLF are an international group of fibs users who have dedicated themselves to making fibs a more enjoyable place. We have existed for over one year during which we have gathered information on the troublemakers of fibs. We have evaluated shouts and interviews conducted with the victims (most of which didn't know they were being interviewed). The results give a clear, unbiased panorama of the worst offenders, regarding bullying, racism, sexism, obnoxiousness and other issues. The names on this list will come as no surprise to most.

N******
d*******
P*******
r********
v********
z********
t*******
s********
Z********
i********

There is always at least one of the JLF logged on. We will report any and all attempts at abuse to Patti.

You will not hear from us again, except in the form of affirmative action by Patti.

The offenders know why they are on the list.

It's tongue-biting time.

You yellow gutless worm even don't deserve a response. Show us your crooked identity and then I will consider the options on how to kick your sorry ass out of FIBS.

PL

[Patti]

Oh, look.  Multiple people are exhibiting behavior that would cost them their shouts on FIBS.

[PersianLord]

Oh, look.  Multiple people are exhibiting behavior that would cost them their shouts on FIBS.

What do you mean?

[stog]

what it means here, is that you are red-carded

[stog]

a day after..
and i have asterisked the list posted anonymously in the drama topic

several folks asked/suggested that we bin the post, remove the list etc, which immediately makes me stop/consider/ walk around etc but/and after consideration, and talks with folks, other moderators and mrs  stog's input - i have compromised as said & asterisked the list..and posts referencing it

the point of this post is to re- affirm our moderator's addage 'don't react too quickly'; we try to allow people's opinions to be voiced, so long as they are not personalised rants..

if a post is obviously hurtful and personalised etc - we bin it

if after consideration we are not sure but still think it should be out of the general view - we stick it in the limbo board..

but really this was a post where i considered that the anonymous voice should be heard, and that the 'strong' characters on the list could very well stand up for themselves, indeed often do in fibs shouts..
(even arguing as to their position on the list, almost provoking the idea of a league in my mind.    )

anyhow some legitimate comments/posts were made very soon after the list, so i decided to leave it in - in context - and PL"s red card should signal that we, here,  will not accept 'bullying' replies/posting, even in response to an anonymous post. (i will reinstate PL's member status at some point if he wants, and if he realises why i red-carded him, and understands that he must think before he types and consider the effect on other people)

i have messaged the list poster to warn them not to personalise/ make lists of names, and suggest that they do not threaten, but let Patti deal with miscreants

here is a copy of the message sent---->

this is a warning  not to personalise and  threaten -- let Patti deal with miscreants

we here on the board allowed your 'anonymous' post, but i have since asterisked the names - as it is indeed an example of the very behaviour you wish to amend in others

i and the other moderators here, will censor any future violations, and if necessary ban ISP's

How people treat you is their karma

How you react is yours

[manxcat]

For the record, I did not write those words.  I inherited them from the author of FIBS.

PersianLord, if you're looking for a language-sanitized playground then perhaps FIBS isn't the place for you.  I'm not much of an advocate for censorship, and I can guarantee you that the language police force will never exist.

It's actually easier to cast a wide net and ban a country than it is to target an individual.  It's situational, but that's generally the case.

I would be massively opposed to having a profanity filter built into FIBS... it offends my sensibilities.  If a client wanted to do that, I'd be less bothered.

just sayin' ;;-)))

[webrunner]

And I already ran into one person lost many years ago to fibs 'drama', who came back to see if it is better...having had a very positive first toe in the water...they stated they very well might become a regular again!

[diane]

just sayin' ;;-)))

It is possible to have an unfiltered, adult arena, where the language may be robust, and the topics of discussion emotional or hard going...without it becoming a personal, nasty fight.

The art of debate is to take smething abut which you are passionate, and emotional, and talk about it with somoeone who does not agree with you, with passion and emotion...and not resort to to calling each other names.

That is how it used to be done - sadly, in these 'sensationalist' times, name calling has become the norm. 

This would be a much nicer world if we could work at trying to persuade people with opposing views via open and logical debate, and if that does not work...simply accept that not everyone will agree with our most heartfelt convictions, and that does not make them a bad person. And further understand that calling them names does not further the debate, nor win them over, nor make you seem wise and wonderful.

[Patti]

Yes ManxCat.  What happened is that some people abused the open forum so badly that I could no longer provide it.  I was left with only two options, and neither of them was particularly appealing.  I opted for the less-extreme of the two.  As is often the case, a few bad apples ruined it for everyone.

I've expressed my wishes many times over the years... I want people to treat each other with courtesty on FIBS.

[NIHILIST]

Why don't you try it yourself ?

I can't recall you ever dealing with anyone in a manner other that rude, ridicule, condescension or holier-than-thou. I invite anyone to read your occasional shouts on FIBS without coming to the same conclusion.

I asked a question of you here about your special treatment of inim, and, predictably, got no answer. When I questioned you about my gagging you played it cute, answering questions with questions instead of giving a simple, one sentence direct response.

It seems pretty clear that you have become what you have beheld. If FIBS has become such a burden for you just close it down and do something you enjoy.

Bob

[dorbel]

I can't recall you ever dealing with anyone in a manner other that rude, ridicule, condescension or holier-than-thou. I invite anyone to read your occasional shouts on FIBS without coming to the same conclusion.

I have read Patti's occasional shouts on fibs, as well as numerous tells and occasional fibsboard messages. I haven't reached the same conclusion.

I have read over the last eleven years more shouts, tells and fibsboard messages from "Bob" than I care to remember. I invite anyone to draw their own conclusions as to what I think of those.

If FIBS has become such a burden for you just close it down and do something you enjoy.

Perhaps there is a way to lighten that burden without closing down fibs.

[diane]

I have read Patti's occasional shouts on fibs, as well as numerous tells and occasional fibsboard messages. I haven't reached the same conclusion.

I have read over the last eleven years more shouts, tells and fibsboard messages from "Bob" than I care to remember. I invite anyone to draw their own conclusions as to what I think of those.

Perhaps there is a way to lighten that burden without closing down fibs.

I couldn't agree more.

[socksey]

Does anyone else see the irony here?   

socksey



Before sunlight can shine through a window, the blinds must be raised. - American proverb

[NIHILIST]

The two of them are saints, never an unkind word for anyone......butter wouldn't melt in their mouths.

Bob

[KissMyAss]

Irony.

Such a beautiful thing when it's pure and unadulterated.  Priceless in it's true form.

[diane]

Does anyone else see the irony here?   

Of course...I put it there....

[diane]

The two of them are saints, never an unkind word for anyone......butter wouldn't melt in their mouths.

Bob

Thankyou, Bob

[moonshadow123]

I rarely shout on the open forum, nonetheless I welcome Patti's new MOTD, as well as the fairly clear and straightforward explanation given here of what is expected.

Why don't you try it yourself ?

I can't recall you ever dealing with anyone in a manner other that rude, ridicule, condescension or holier-than-thou. I invite anyone to read your occasional shouts on FIBS without coming to the same conclusion.

This is a demonstrably fallacious assertion in that one only need to show one instance of where Patti was not either rude, showing ridicule, being condescending or holier-than-thou to rationally dismiss and correctly regard as suspect any other claims NIHILIST may make regarding Patti, including NIHILIST's claim in this thread that Patti is not "fair"--a concept that in the absence of objective morality may logically be attributed to both Adolf Hitler and Mahatma Gandhi.

When one compares the decade plus shout record of NIHILIST with that of pattis it becomes, to put it mildly, an intellectual challenge, as the shout data for patti is dwarfed by several orders of magnitude by the data available for username NIHILIST.

What further belies NIHILISTs credibility on the right to even evaluate as to whether patti is fair or not is that in the first post in this thread, that while giving lip service by saying he has no gripe with the new MOTD as loosely summed up as "be nice" and "stop hurling insults", that he merely uses that as a pretext to be as insulting as a possible, sans the shock vulgarity permitted on the open shout forum  but which would be redacted by rule here on fibsboard, and to use inflammatory, snide, and in-your-face language that patti  "powders inim's bottom".

Tangentially, I agree and align myself with many of shouter NIHILISTs stated political views, analysis on politics, economics, social issues and global warming, but cringe in the manner in which he engages those of opposing views by pugilistic insult ,ad hominem, shock vulgarity and complete lack of graciousness.

I asked a question of you here about your special treatment of inim, and, predictably, got no answer.

This was not a question, but phrased as a belligerent accusation that assumed guilt of unspecified "special privileges" before knowing all or any of the facts of circumstances which may not even exist in the first place, which is tantamount to bullying.  In light of some of patti and inim's responses here in the thread, some explanations have been given, which once again allows the rational mind to completely reject NIHILIST's claim that he "predictably got no answer" from Patti as false.

Appended after the above and in response to:

thank u moonshadow, i didn't know how to explain my rage, but u got it just right

"Rage" is not good and neither do I wish to provoke it. Lest I be misunderstood I do believe in things like repentance, redemption and forgiveness and the NIHILIST persona of today, for one reason or another, is arguably less combative and nasty than in the past and his shouts regarding helping buy a young poor kid a bus ticket so he could travel to where a job awaited, donating computers to JT and wildthing/manxcat at personal expense are inspiring and if one is going to shout, those are certainly nice things to shout about and I for one appreciated that.