BAGOLYMPIC

[tryout]

I was invited to be a TD, in a one-line invitation from somebody called Keyser Soze.

Where is it written that you have to be invited to run a tournament, thus being a TD?

All you need is a pencil and a piece of paper and a lot of good will. There's no rule that a tourney can only be run with the help of Tourneybot or tbot.

Besides, do you really think that only TDs may express an opinion as to how tournaments should be run? If you do, then I find that attitude displays perfectly the arrogant and elitist style of administration that I am attempting to criticise.

You imply far too much in your posts. Do you think this is a good basis for a discussion? I'd appreciate if you restrict yourself to write about yourself and not try to put any nonsense into other people's mouth.

You are entitled to disagree with this, as with any opinion that I express, but the continually offensive tone that you use when speaking to me does you no credit.

Could it be your  bias while reading what I write that makes you think that?

Please go ahead and elaborate on the difference between the following two quotes. I'm very curious about your allegations.

Would you care to explain how Diane or any other TD could impede your choice of who you play or meet on FIBS by disallowing a player from a tournament? Did anybody forbid you to play a particular player on FIBS?

Diane tells us that "Bago is really intended for good players who know how to use Fibs". Would she care to justify this shockingly elitist statement and explain exactly why bad players are not welcome? She may also care to define good and bad in this context.

I'm noting your ability to use the 3rd person during a discussion with that same person.

Also, I'm getting the impression that you think repeating incorrect statements or allegations will make them right. Or do you hope that people will simply believe it when you have said it the umteenth time?

Come on guys, get down off this high horse and display some of the tolerance for different types of people and the welcome for new players that should be the lifeblood of the game!

Here we go again. Nonsense allegations and implications...

[tryout]

Diane does indeed work hard on the tournaments and has contributed a lot to improving fibs. She should be applauded for this and I applaud it.

So far I've only seen you bickering around.

This shouldn't mean that her statements should be immune from criticism, or that she should close her ears to contrary points of view, although she, Eddy and tryout seem to think that it should. Why is that?

Why is it that you always imply wrong things? Are you doing this on purpose?

And how about airing your "criticism" in another way than that only your point of view is correct? Contrary points of view seem to be fine only when it doesn't apply to you.

[dorbel]

Well tryout, it's not a difficult question. Do you really think that only TDs may express an opinion as to how tournaments should be run? An answer would clarify many things.
I may indeed be assuming too much in crediting you with an offensive tone. You may care to reassure me that that is not the case, as in the past I have attempted to reassure you.
I don't find it possible to elaborate on the difference between the two quotes that you ask me to compare. The difference between them is that one quote is by you and one is by me. As they are about different subjects, I fail to understand the point that you are trying to make. Perhaps you would care to elaborate?
Generally speaking, I use the first person when addressing somebody in particular, as in a reply to their post. I tend to use the third person when making points of my own. If I sometimes confuse the cases and step outside that convention, it is just bad grammar. What is your point?
Which of my statements or allegations are incorrect? Did diane really not say this? She has certainly said something different on other occasions. Which should I choose?
Finally, if my "allegations and implications" are really nonsense, then please demonstrate that this is so by refuting them. An answer to the question which starts this post and a clear statement that you do not approve of banning players for rudeness in shouts, multi nicks and lack of experience, would demonstrate amply that the TDs in general and you in particular, are indeed democratic, inclusive and definitely not cliquey.

[socksey]

Great minds think alike, diane!  I was thinking the "don" thought at apparently the same time.  

Dorbel, I see where you are trying to go with this (maybe), but I must say that your tone could improve.  

Diane has done an excellent job as a TD.  Your post seemed critical.  From that point onward, I became defensive of diane and wanted to bop you on the head.  Not that I would ever do that, but I only felt like it for a moment.   :angry:  

Please join the TD's, dorbel!  Tourneybot has free access.  You keep talking about it, and keep being critical of how the tourneys are run. but you haven't experienced walking in our shoes yet.  May I ask why?  

Having a newbie in your tournament can be rather trying, to say the least.  Having a very slow EXPERIENCED player can be trying, as well.  We are expecting to be tied up for a minimum amount of time when we host a tournament.  When that time extends by as little as a half hour and sometimes up to 1 1/2 hours, it can reek havoc to our other life.  I suspect this is why some of the TD's rarely run a tournament and why we don't have more TD's.

I say to you that if I were not allowed to ban whoever I think needs to be banned, as a TD, I wouldn't be TDing.  We put up with a lot that the casual observer doesn't see.  Most of us rarely bans anyone, so I think we should be given a lot of credit rather than your (or anyone's) criticism.

Oh, and did I mention the player who continually shouts that I won't allow him in my tourneys, who has always been welcome in my tourneys?  And, did I mention this same player has also harrassed me through at least one entire tourney with constant questions in chats?  This sheds a whole new light to multi-tasking!  

As for banning anyone because of what they say in shouts, I don't agree with that, for myself, but I do, absolutely agree, that any TD should have the right to ban anyone they choose within their own tournament.  As far as I've seen, we have a very fair group who tend to use excellent judgment.  I'm sure none of us are perfection, but certainly, all of us try hard.

socksey



The kindest word, is an unkind word, not spoken. - unknown

[dorbel]

Some people contribute nothing to fibs socksey. You contribute, diane contributes, tryout contributes, even I contribute in my own way, but I choose not to contribute as a TD. I will ask you what tryout seems so reluctant to answer. Should only TDs express an opinion as to how tournaments should be run?

[socksey]

Certainly, all opinions are welcome, as well as constructive critism, I'm sure.  Just be careful you don't start beating up on one of us, or you will have all of us in your face.

We can all learn from ideas, and thank you for the ones you have expressed in a kindly manner.  

socksey



"Sometimes the things that upset us the most are the things we need to work on the most" --- unknown
   

[webrunner]

I think the point dorbel is trying to make is:
If TD's are contributing tourneys to fibs for the players , why can't the players critisize on them?

I think this is a valid question.

Are TD's holding the tournaments for themselves or for others?
In the end that is the question. This prolly differs for every TD.

Just my one and a half cents (and i am NOT a TD btw)

[diane]

If TD's are contributing tourneys to fibs for the players , why can't the players critisize on them?

I think this is a valid question.

Are TD's holding the tournaments for themselves or for others?
In the end that is the question. This prolly differs for every TD.

All questions are valid - all attacks are not.  I have said this over and over - I will listen to anything as long as it does not come as an attack.

I still think there is merit in limiting this single tournament to players who have been here a little while - and have seen nothing to convince me otherwise.  I have even listened  

Also - I appreciate that others feel differently - and thus they can do as they wish - but I will impose this small limitation to ensure the majority enjoy this now very popular tournament.

I will continue to make sure as many as possible enjoy tournaments in general - and if that means I have to type the same stuff 50 times an hour - I will keep on doing it.

All suggestions to improve tournaments are welcome - and I will take on board as many as possible (just as I have always done) - but really the amount of discontent the situation on tuesday caused to what is otherwise a great and fun event was very upsetting.

I just want to fix that - and I cannot see the harm in saying this one tournament is for slightly more experienced players.  I also must point out that I have chased down players who were unaware - newish, oldish and genereally tourney shy to come and join in. If I have to turn someone away with this setting - I will be sure and explain it thoroughly - and make sure that they know they are welcome as soon as they reach the requisite number of exp points.

[scardy]

gogogiz had banned dirtyhands (slots and blot)from his tourneys because,

a/,Its better than shooting him

b/he said nasty things in shout

c/he has been sending lots of messages of an offending nature to people on fibs.

if you really want to know what kind of stuff ring (+0044)  08984433221199 or visit www.imawankapervertstalker.com  

IMPORTANT this is not a pole !!

ps, webrunner its not a real number.

Sunglasses sponser mrbond    

[tryout]

Well tryout, it's not a difficult question. Do you really think that only TDs may express an opinion as to how tournaments should be run? An answer would clarify many things.

I'm astonished.

Firstly, that you keep on implying nonsense, such as that I ever said before "that only TDs may express an opinion as to how tournaments should be run". And please don't try to weasel out. The formulation of "do you really think" leaves no choice than to understand that I stated it before. Which of course I have not.

Secondly, may I help your memory and point you to what I replied to you a month ago in another thread on this site:

But naturally, we are open to well meant, constructive suggestions. However, we still reserve to have our own opinion.

If you believe that my statement is no answer to your not difficult question I will spell it out clearly: It goes without saying that everybody can have and state her/his own opinion how to run tournaments.

It must however be expected that other people, including TDs, have a different opinion and will not simply follow whatever they are criticized for.

I may indeed be assuming too much in crediting you with an offensive tone. You may care to reassure me that that is not the case, as in the past I have attempted to reassure you.

My intentions are far from offending you. Why should I?

But I find it rather annoying that I have to respond to your accusations, wrong allegations and nonsense. And it appears that you don't stop doing it.

I don't find it possible to elaborate on the difference between the two quotes that you ask me to compare. The difference between them is that one quote is by you and one is by me. As they are about different subjects, I fail to understand the point that you are trying to make. Perhaps you would care to elaborate?

No? In your post to which I was replying you accused me of "the continually offensive tone that you use when speaking to me". Therefore the quote of your post, which it seems you're ignoring. So the point is obviously your (again) wrong accusation.

Your accusation refered to my post from which I took the subsequent quote, that you apparently feel to be "continually offensive".
Then I took the freedom of quoting a post of you which uses the same formulation like I did, with the exception that you for some reason chose to use the 3rd person.

Based on the assumption that you of course do not voice yourself in an offensive tone I don't see how I could when I used the same phrasing, but even with a more personal attitude instead of your (at least seemingly) condescending use of the 3rd person.

Understood?

Finally, if my "allegations and implications" are really nonsense, then please demonstrate that this is so by refuting them.

E.g. see above. And you are already now wasting a lot of my time with your endless wrong implications, allegations and accusations. If you're not happy with my response I guess I'll have to stop to have conversations with you since I won't turn it into an hobby entertaining you on this board.

[tryout]

Some people contribute nothing to fibs socksey. You contribute, diane contributes, tryout contributes, even I contribute in my own way, but I choose not to contribute as a TD.

Uhm, sorry if I miss the obvious. In which way have you contributed to FIBS?

I will ask you [socksey] what tryout seems so reluctant to answer.

I'm very sorry that I don't have continuous internet access and neither all day to devote to you. You're succeeding in annoying me more and more with your attitude.

[tryout]

I say to you that if I were not allowed to ban whoever I think needs to be banned, as a TD, I wouldn't be TDing. We put up with a lot that the casual observer doesn't see. Most of us rarely bans anyone, so I think we should be given a lot of credit rather than your (or anyone's) criticism.

As for banning anyone because of what they say in shouts, I don't agree with that, for myself, but I do, absolutely agree, that any TD should have the right to ban anyone they choose within their own tournament. As far as I've seen, we have a very fair group who tend to use excellent judgment. I'm sure none of us are perfection, but certainly, all of us try hard.

All questions are valid - all attacks are not. I have said this over and over - I will listen to anything as long as it does not come as an attack.

Full acknowledgment. All of the above can't be repeated enough. I've tried to say this in quite a lot of previous posts. Not sure whether I succeeded, though I hope so.

TDs, keep up the good work!  

[dorbel]

Thank you for your answer tryout. It is now quite clear to me that you do indeed welcome well-meant and constructive criticism. I can't imagine why I was unable to see that before.
In your posts you refer again and again to "accusations" and "allegations" that I make against you. I have reread every post in this thread and can find neither of these in any post made by me, apart from (1) suggesting that I found your tone offensive and (2) suggesting that you among others felt that TDs should not be criticised. As you have now reassured me on one point and corrected me on the other I am more than happy to withdraw these slurs on your character.
Finally I must decline to list what I give back to the backgammon community in general and to fibs in particular, on the grounds that to do so would be tasteless self-advertisment.

[Tomawaky]

HI there !
Tonight I will be back and host the second Session of the october's Bagolympic. I wait for this occasion hundreds of players  

See you tonight .......

[diane]

Does this mean I get a session off - YIPEEE   :jump2:

I shall try to come and just enjoy playing for once    

[Tomawaky]

You're welcome diane