FIBS Board backgammon forum

Robot Wars

Poll

Would you be interested in watching a bot tournament?

yes
12 (42.9%)
no
16 (57.1%)

Total Members Voted: 28

Author Topic: Robot Wars  (Read 8016 times)

Offline diane

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Robot Wars
« on: August 20, 2004, 06:47:52 PM »
Since not many people have said whether or not they are interested in this - I thought it might be easier to gauge the interest via a poll. Please vote - and then we can see if the work required is worth it.
 
« Last Edit: January 20, 2011, 11:07:53 AM by diane »
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Robot Wars
« on: August 20, 2004, 06:47:52 PM »

Offline diane

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Re: Robot Wars
« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2011, 04:19:08 AM »
Finally - 6.5 years on - we watched some bot games today!  

See attached file for true bot luck  ;)...
« Last Edit: January 20, 2011, 04:47:47 AM by diane »
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Re: Robot Wars
« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2011, 04:19:08 AM »

Offline socksey

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Re: Robot Wars
« Reply #2 on: January 20, 2011, 05:05:00 AM »
How fast are they playing?   :unsure:  Are they slow enough to learn something?   :)

socksey



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Offline diane

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Re: Robot Wars
« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2011, 06:54:28 AM »
Very fast..4 x 13 point matches played out at >2000 in under 30 minutes  ;)

That is the point of attaching the file - that you can load up and go slowly through. 

I missed two though - not knowing which bots to watch - and getting there so slowly as to miss almost a whole first game!!
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Re: Robot Wars
« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2011, 06:54:28 AM »

Offline PersianLord

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Re: Robot Wars
« Reply #4 on: January 20, 2011, 08:31:58 AM »
Absurd idea. With GNUBG free at our avail, why would one be interested in watching two bots, which are based on GNUBG also, fighting each other at FIBS?!

Patti has shortened the allowed idle time for we humans in order to provide an opportunity for every fibster to enjoy the limited lots FIBS can provide at each time. Now letting the bots hang on by playing each other is a grave breach to that policy. Bots are created to please those fibsters who are in favor of fast and yet high-quality opponents. Also as one of the most frequent bot players, I don't want to wait for bots to finish playing with each other.

PL
The leftist's feelings of inferiority run so deep that he cannot tolerate any classification of some things as successful or superior and other things as failed or inferior. This also underlies the rejection by many leftists of the concept of mental illness and of the utility of IQ tests.  - T.K

Offline diane

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Re: Robot Wars
« Reply #5 on: January 20, 2011, 08:42:21 AM »
This was done at 'off peak' time, when the bots are pretty much idling in the ready list, and I wasnt timing out in 15 minutes - which gives you an idea of how 'off peak' it is.

I can see your point of view...and we definitely should avoid peak times if this does become a 'feature'.

What has been speculated about btw, is having an 'exhibition match' in some regular spot...and of course, no one is forced to watch, or to be involved in any way.

This split of opinion was very much in evidence at the time the original thread was written [which inspired the poll], and it was clear frm the poll, that of those who cared at all, back in 2004, more of them would have enjoyed this, as a one off event...

I would hope you would be supportive of an event taking place in which plenty of fibsters were interested, assuming it didnt take bandwidth off humans who want to play...even if you are personally not interested.
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Offline stog

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Re: Robot Wars
« Reply #6 on: January 20, 2011, 09:35:13 AM »
if there was an occasional exhibition match, it would be important to 'delay' their plays by a few seconds a move, to allow assimilation & comment by watchers.

Offline diane

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Re: Robot Wars
« Reply #7 on: January 20, 2011, 10:14:04 AM »
Maybe..but quite a lot of the appeal of watching them at all IS the speed..it is quite hypnotic...but no..you type 'wot a cheat'...and the moment is long past  :laugh: :laugh:

The novelty would wear off quite soon I think...it is mostly about seeing if absolutely perfect play made a difference to how a match 'looks'.

We saw two separate instances of 'dancing on a one point board'...several of getting out from behind a six prime [we are failry sure neither bot rolled 7-7, but is hard to see how else they did it  :laugh:], many more of winning by hitting a last checker in the bear off - all those 'joker' moments that get humans soooo strung out.

In each case, the play was perfect, and the luckiest bot won...

And no one whined, no one cursed..and no one threw anything  ;)
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Re: Robot Wars
« Reply #7 on: January 20, 2011, 10:14:04 AM »

Offline PersianLord

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Re: Robot Wars
« Reply #8 on: January 20, 2011, 10:28:27 AM »
If the matches are played at 'off-peak' times, it is OK to me, even though I won't be interested in watching.

The only type of bot-vs-bot exhibition that would interest me is between bots which have been 'modified' by some fellow fibster developers/engineers. For instance, I'd like to see a battle between inim's ultimate bot vs Tom's.

PL
The leftist's feelings of inferiority run so deep that he cannot tolerate any classification of some things as successful or superior and other things as failed or inferior. This also underlies the rejection by many leftists of the concept of mental illness and of the utility of IQ tests.  - T.K

Offline diane

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Re: Robot Wars
« Reply #9 on: January 20, 2011, 11:03:29 AM »
The only type of bot-vs-bot exhibition that would interest me is between bots which have been 'modified' by some fellow fibster developers/engineers. For instance, I'd like to see a battle between inim's ultimate bot vs Tom's.

I might be wrong of course...but one of those today was an inim v Tom war...check with inim though, he might have something else up his sleeve that is even more super  ;)
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Offline Sequit

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Re: Robot Wars
« Reply #10 on: January 20, 2011, 03:13:33 PM »
I watched the bots play, and it was interesting. Seeing a bot lose to a bot 0/13 certainly brought home the luck factor in backgammon. Some of the moves was very interesting, also. I voted, no, for a tourney. A demonstration match at times is enough.

Offline dorbel

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Re: Robot Wars
« Reply #11 on: January 20, 2011, 03:59:02 PM »
Two points. (1) Bot play is not perfect play. All bots make small mistakes and occasionally large ones that don't show up until you analyse the match closely with rollouts. Typically they have a Snowie error rate of about 1 when you examine their play in detail, still better than any human of course.
(2) As far as watching and learning is concerned, such matches have little value even for experts. You can't take it in at that speed. However, an expert commentating and rolling at a pace that allows time for a comment and elaboration if required would be tremendously useful.

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Re: Robot Wars
« Reply #11 on: January 20, 2011, 03:59:02 PM »

Offline NIHILIST

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Re: Robot Wars
« Reply #12 on: January 20, 2011, 08:02:04 PM »
I think I'd rather watch old people f**k.

Bob
« Last Edit: January 20, 2011, 08:22:28 PM by socksey »
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Offline ah_clem

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Re: Robot Wars
« Reply #13 on: January 21, 2011, 04:11:27 PM »
I think I'd rather watch old people f**k.


TMI, dude.

Offline NIHILIST

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Re: Robot Wars
« Reply #14 on: January 21, 2011, 07:55:12 PM »
Gotta be more exciting than watching bots play each other.

Bob
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Offline PersianLord

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Re: Robot Wars
« Reply #15 on: January 22, 2011, 05:40:40 AM »
I think I'd rather watch old people f**k.

Bob

I agree with your creative, ingenius, breakthrough, heart-breaking, history-making, absurd idea; wholeheardtedly.

PL
The leftist's feelings of inferiority run so deep that he cannot tolerate any classification of some things as successful or superior and other things as failed or inferior. This also underlies the rejection by many leftists of the concept of mental illness and of the utility of IQ tests.  - T.K

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Re: Robot Wars
« Reply #15 on: January 22, 2011, 05:40:40 AM »

Offline stog

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Re: Robot Wars
« Reply #16 on: January 22, 2011, 09:02:22 AM »
 :sexe:[spoiler]when i get a moment, i shall add some links you both may find agreeable  :nono:, together with a helpline number [/spoiler]

 

anything