I was told that this ridicuolous rule was over.
I can't invite players from my own site?!?
Do you mean my same country!?!
That's RIDICULOUS!!!!
I have a league match to play vs Paolone.
And what if I wanted to play with one of my italian friends, or if I wanted to teach to someone who can't speak foreign languages, for example?!
Furthermore, I see that a German can play vs a German, an American can play vs another American... SO?!?!?!
It is an idiot rule, it does not make sense at all, and I can't see *any* reason why every italian have to pay for whatever FIBS admins have with our country.
Someone could please explain it to me??
When I first encountered this rule, I was in Master League, I had two or three matches to play, and I could not play my match with paolone.
I was so bothered that I did not play my remaining matches neither (btw, I went down to Gold League) and I seriously considered quitting with FIBS.
Then, after playing another tournament on GG, I took a pause from BG in general.
Somehow I missed BG, FIBS and FIBSleague and when someone told me the rule was not valid anymore, I started to play again.
Now I know it's still valid, and I am really pissed off.
FIBS is a great *idea*, it's OPEN, because everyone with an internet access can play on it, it's free (thanks Kit Woolsey) and it does not matter the operating system.
But it's actually CLOSE, like 'CLOSED MIND'.
No will to develop or to share the control... is it just that someone feels *POWERFUL* by keeping full control on something that in good percentage owes its success to the community and to all that people that helped out with software, tournament organization, t-shirts, events, HTML code, translations...?
Unreasonable...
It's a great idea that is not being applied.
It's surviving just because of all the workarounds that people are building within the system's limitations: bots, tournaments...
I was very hopeful when alef, burper, and some others started to think about a new project to be developed on the basis of FIBS, but I lost track of it and now I guess it failed.
Did it?
I guess I must subscribe on GamesGrid.
ciao
Aram
AramKhan on FIBS
I can't understand this rule and agreed with all what you say.
So What I can suggest is to play your matchs on another server like TMG, GammonEmpire, Zone yahoo even DailyGammon.....if you want to go on with the league. And I am sure that other people will be please to play with you on other server. FibsLeagammon is not necessary to be played at Fibs...
We encounter those kind of trouble cause it's free, and if it was an open project, I think we could have other kind of trouble.
.........
I will be please with a perfect Fibs, not sur that's the perfect exist :(
We need italians to play with, don't leave :rolleyes:
QuoteI was told that this ridicuolous rule was over.
I can't invite players from my own site?!?
Do you mean my same country!?!
That's RIDICULOUS!!!!
FIBS is a great *idea*, it's OPEN, because everyone with an internet access can play on it, it's free (thanks Kit Woolsey) and it does not matter the operating system.
It's a great idea that is not being applied.
It's surviving just because of all the workarounds that people are building within the system's limitations: bots, tournaments...
I was very hopeful when alef, burper, and some others started to think about a new project to be developed on the basis of FIBS, but I lost track of it and now I guess it failed.
Did it?
I guess I must subscribe on GamesGrid.
I cant believe this is still going on either :angry: It makes no sense!! I have played you Aram - and found it a most pleasant and enjoyable match. Thinking you are restricted in your use of FIBS, while others who are much worse continue to enjoy it unhindered, really pisses me off too. This is ridiculus - and, I am sure, not the original intention of FIBS!
I am also sorry it already caused you to avoid FIBS for a long time - I did wonder why you had chosen not to play for a session - and further sorry this may drive you off FIBS altogether. :(
I dont know what happened to the alternatives which were so enthusiastically chatted about at one time - but I do know the biggest problem is time - not many people (who have the required expertise) have the amount of free time required to get any alternative up and running without help.
Of those willing to get involved - there were also slight differences of opinions - and it seemed quite a task to get a shared view for a future alternative - some of the projects were simply too grand to be realised.
I too wish it could be done - so FIBS could be a more modern and flexible site - but at the very least - so people from the same country can play a match with each other without having to resort to all these complicated arrangements!!
QuoteI can't invite players from my own site?!?
Do you mean my same country!?!
That's RIDICULOUS!!!!
[...]
It is an idiot rule, it does not make sense at all, and I can't see *any* reason why every italian have to pay for whatever FIBS admins have with our country.
[...]
Hi Aram,
I'm sorry to hear about the unfortunate rule that was probably put in force by a well-meaning Patti. As with the German t-online (if I recall correctly) user ban that she implemented about a year ago or so, it is "shooting with cannons at sparrows", as we say in German, or "pouring out the child with the bath".
I'm sure that our common complaints will convince her to abandon this ban quickly. Please don't be mad at Patti or FIBS. I'm as astonished as Diane that you stopped playing at FIBS because you were annoyed... after all, I'm looking forward to waking you up again with a telephone call for a league match ;-).
I think, as I always did, that one should ignore droppers as well as rating cheaters.
Looking forward to playing you soon in the masters play-offs,
Peter aka the juggler
Hi Aram,
In case you can't find another viable solution I could set up a proxy server on my computer for an hour or two via which you could connect to FIBS for at least this particular league match. You'd be sailing under German disguise then. :) Please contact me by mail if you're interested.
I agree with juggler that the only thing that may help is sending reasonabe mails to Patti. The bad thing with it is that you have to hope for a reply at all.
But what's a bit strange and I'm curious about is how this is implemented. A ban based on an IP range is simple and done with an external (from the server code) packet filter. Then you couldn't log in at all. But a rule that prohibits a match between two players with specific characteristics (in this case both having an Italian ISP) requires that it's coded in the FIBS server. And I have doubts that marvin implemented this.
Maybe someone has another idea or there's another cause?
Hi Aram and others,
I suggest creating a poll here about this rule and if a lot of people support you then messaging Patti with a link to this poll. This is a long run solution to your problem.
A short run solution is available too. You can use another server as Tomawaky said to play the league matches or use an IP German disguise as Tryout suggested.
Please don't leave us. All players are important in this community!!!
What exactly is this RULE that has everyone so upset ? Best I can determine is that it somehow prevents players from playing others from their own site.
Is this unique to some Italian site or is it system wide and applicable to all internet addresses ?
NIHI
It is specific to Italian players - how exactly it is implemented - as you have seen - is not clear - but the net result is that one player from Italy cannot play a match with another person from Italy, well not in the same way a player from England can play another player from England anyway. Or any other country for that matter. There are other threads that deal with the problem and how it came about - but it was to stop one troublesome player from cheating as I recall. The situation also included the player sending threats to Patti.
Hi
I am pretty sure Patti implemented that rule, since she got pissed off by one or possibly more users from Italy. I think she got spammed, but judging by the rule, it seems likely that the user played himself on different accounts, with different ip:s
That explains a lot MND!!! Patti was forced to make this rule to put a barrier to their illegal action!!!
QuoteThat explains a lot MND!!! Patti was forced to make this rule to put a barrier to their illegal action!!!
Jesus Christ!!.... can't do a move without bumping into you... :no: ...
QuoteQuoteThat explains a lot MND!!! Patti was forced to make this rule to put a barrier to their illegal action!!!
Jesus Christ!!.... can't do a move without bumping into you... :no: ...
Look who's talking shades ;)
QuoteThat explains a lot MND!!! Patti was forced to make this rule to put a barrier to their illegal action!!!
It would be well worth reading this if you missed it first time around - from what I gathered it was less about stopping cheating - and more about the threats - after all - there are people prepared to cheat in all countries.
Background info (http://www.fibsboard.com/index.php?showtopic=422&st=0#)
It was just a conclusion, Shades. Sorry, if i didn't take your permission before posting it.
Thx u Diane for the background info!!! i didn't know the whole story!!! :cool:
QuoteQuoteQuoteThat explains a lot MND!!! Patti was forced to make this rule to put a barrier to their illegal action!!!
Jesus Christ!!.... can't do a move without bumping into you... :no: ...
Look who's talking shades ;)
ooops.... who said that??? :rolleyes:
QuoteIt was just a conclusion, Shades. Sorry, if i didn't take your permission before posting it.
Thx u Diane for the background info!!! i didn't know the whole story!!! :cool:
hanging yourself here.... you advice...you comment.... and then come to the conclusion you don't know nothing about what you are talking... thats my point... and you have my permission to try to be carcastic again...
I believe that advices and comments are allowed here!!!
At least, I don't judge people, like you do, Shades :D
QuoteI believe that advices and comments are allowed here!!!
At least, I don't judge people, like you do, Shades :D
keep running like a headless chicken.... I just love " intelligent " who don't know how stupid they are... :ohmaster:
We are out of topic Shades and you start this as always....I will end this conversation here.... I will give u a final answer and I will not reply again.
All the advices and comments i made in all of my replies are centralized around the topic. What about yours?
Keep walking......
QuoteWe are out of topic Shades and you start this as always....I will end this conversation here.... I will give u a final answer and I will not reply again.
All the advices and comments i made in all of my replies are centralized around the topic. What about yours?
Keep walking......
....(......)....!!!! :rolleyes: ... promised??
Is this the reason why I can't play vs other italians since months?
I translated the email as soon I saw it in another thread, you will find it below.
I just can guess... did he say "shoot you" instead of "do shoot to yourself"?
In italian sparati = spara(shoot)+ti(you/yourself/to you/to yourself)
However... :huh:
what about the hundreds of droppers, that, by the way, are already managed through the use of RepBot.
and what about this: what does an (hypotetic) threat have to do with that? Is that a kind of reprisal? "10 italians for every nazist killed". No matter if they are innocent.
And, by the way, discriminating us for just being italian is, by all means, *racism*.
Does this stupid rule block any kind of threat to anyone?
Then we should immediately ban backgammon all over the world, maybe we would have PEACE for everyone.
Or is it just what I called it, a reprisal?
If Patti can prove that she has been threatened I will be glad to help her going to a Police Station to denounce the responsible.
But I will not write her until I'm still pissed off as I am.
Aram
---
Dear Claudio_first,
here I will tell what really happened.
I had two nicknames deleted, they had arrived in a very short time to 2000 and 1900 rating.
Then I asked Patti why and she answered that she saw some suspect resigns.
That's probably true, someone was in a hurry and resigned and I accepted: she told me that resigns are not to be accepted.
That evening we talked for about three hours.
Later I created a nick, "affirmed", note that italians already could not play each other so I mathematically could not have any help from anyone. Sure, you could tell me I may have friends all over the world that give me points as a present, but this is just sophism. I got to 1850 with 150 exp and two saved games, the last one was vs Piuma (*AK note: I know personally Piuma*) and I won 7-0 and after that nothing, darkness, deleted again. Then I got upset and I wrote her in the private chat a series of bad words and in the end I told her: "shoot to yourself, idiot".
Maybe I exaggerated -surely- and I publicly apologize, I am sad for those who at the moment cannot play.
I wanted to tell how things went even because I heard that I threatened her by email, this is what she is saying.
I never threatened anyone, even less I threatened her for such a stupid thing where right is 100% on my side.
I conclude saying that she is good with bad words as well, even though it is still nothing compared to what we can read daily into the public chat.
I hope for you all that she soon will re-open the site and reassure her telling her that I could never enter again in such a discriminating game.
I greet you and I am really sorry for the event.
PS: unfortunately here if one plays well he doesn't get rewarded but banned. Ciao!
Thank you very much for the encouragements, the proxy offers, and other suggestions.
Unfortunately they did not change the feeling I had from the start.
I used to consider FIBS my 'backgammon home', as claudio_first underlined in another thread.
But I can't be subject to all that arbitrariness and still feel comfortable.
I realize that FIBS is just one of the BG servers available on the internet, and all the pros and cons are to be weighed.
As usual the more you loved something the more you get upset or feel sorry when it comes to an end.
Now I am a zen monk -_-
Cheers
-AK
Just remember also where your friends hang out Aram ;)
I know, this will be put between the "pros".
I will play on FIBS when I have to play or I want to play on FIBS... that's normal :)
Besides, many friends already left, others almost did.
I can find them on GG or PMW, as others can be found on FIBS.
Moi KG :)
AK
hey Aram,
Who the hell said you are Italian , tell Patti you are like me armenian and all should be well
unless there is going to be a rule no armenian can play another armenian.
Look i a kidding but Patti is always open minded , you have to talk to her , she will not be bullied over my polls or people yelling. She will shut it down until everyone cools off.
just make you case ands see where it goes with her.
I've developed some fairly sophisticated tools for detecting cheaters over the last year or two, and they have done a pretty decent job of making a few people squeal after they got caught.
The intra-Italy play ban is there because a few bad apples have ruined it for everyone. I don't particularly like the rule, but I feel that it has been a net win for the site. It's not a personal prejudice against Italians, but a reluctant response to a very bad problem.
It will remain until the troublemakers go elsewhere.
And yes, hurling insults and threats at me is exactly the wrong way to make your point. As you would expect, I don't look especially favorably on people who do that.
By the way, just how many accounts do you have, affirmed/sirlad/matchem/thrylion?
Hi there,
I can see that Patti joins fibsboard and she starts answering a lot of questions about fibs server.
I want to make a suggestion Webrunner. Why don't you create a new forum in "bot's and other tech stuff" about fibs server. If Patti agrees, she can lead this forum and all related topics like this one can be transferred there.
Patti doesn't agree. I have enough stuff going on in my life already... I don't want to add the responsibility of moderating another discussion forum.
I dropped in because someone talked to me about fixing the horrible flaws in RepBot, and I have very strong feelings about topic. I'm unwilling to commit to spending a lot of time here, though. (BTW, is there an RSS feed? I hate having to go to individual sites to get to discussion forums; I'd rather have them all rolled into one.)
Hi Patti,
I am looking to upgrade fibsboard to a new script that will have an rss feed.
This is a big job so it will take a while.
It could be made easier for you though.
I could make an forum especially for you on wich you could subscribe by email.
Everytime someone posts an email will be send to you.
This is all i can do for now.
But more will definitely be coming.
;)
Of it sirlad would has only one Patti, if you did not cancel them always uselessly und unjustly. This is only racim. Prouve all that things u say to sirlad ,thrylion and matchem
prouve prouve prouve
Once sirlad is playing with someone and Patti came to watch and asked sirlad why the cube is 8.(because sirlad was winning) lol are we under GESTAPO?
Patti ask to all players why the cube is 8 or 4 or 12?
Patti order all players to resume their saved games?
and now if sirlad want to connect with fibs, fibs answer ........."make love with you " lol
Do you come from Eton College?
QuotePatti ask to all players why the cube is 8 or 4 or 12?
You must be Ã,´Ã,´cleanÃ,´Ã,´ as you did not set the cube to more than 8...... :D
QuotePatti ask to all players why the cube is 8 or 4 or 12?
Since when can a cube be 12??? :D
Well notice :D
Maybe take a cube 16
Break it in 2 part
Add a cube 4....
LOL just kidding
QuoteThe intra-Italy play ban is there because a few bad apples have ruined it for everyone.Ã, I don't particularly like the rule, but I feel that it has been a net win for the site.Ã, It's not a personal prejudice against Italians, but a reluctant response to a very bad problem.
It will remain until the troublemakers go elsewhere.
I see. As I said, I guess I'll manage to live with that rule.
I apologize with Patti and everyone for losing my cool.
It happens when I think I have been wronged.
Anyway, although I still disagree, it is not worth all that anger.
About the League, Tomawaky, probably I found a workaround: I should be travelling to paolone's city in the next weeks, so maybe we will play our match 'live'. :lol:
Otherwise you could give 2 points to both :) A draw!
Hm... I think it will not save me from Silver, I'm losing too much lately. :D
CiaoCiao
--AK
PS: LOL@vegasvic -> khelk's sire'm!! ira'v e'! :lol:
PPS: Just to avoid some possible equivocity... the letter to Claudio_first was not mine, eh!!
QuoteHm... I think it will not save me from Silver, I'm losing too much lately. :D
I knew there had to be a positive side to the fact that I am headed rapidly towards bronze... ;)
Aram,
I talked to Patti extensively on this subject. Apparently, she claimed that preventing all players with an Italy based IP address to play each otther was the most effective ant simplest way to impede some jerk to cheat.
It's clear that such a decision is made feasible only becouse, by chance, there are far less players in Italy than in most other countries: you could never do a similar thing on players from, say, delaware or south england, simply becouse theri IP addresses are mixed to those of millions others.
While I fully share your opinion, and feel this procedure is inappropriate, I may suggest you to use Parlorplay when you want to play other Italians, as I do. Loggin onto FIBS via Parlorplay makes your real IP address invisible to FIBS.
Ciao !
Magowiz
Parlorplay has long been known to cheaters and other troublemakers for the very reason of hiding the ISP. Unfortunately, it is used by some, I am told, when away from home computer ligitimately. Currently, there is a push to ban Parlorplay site. This is another problem of the problem makers causing problems for all. :tears:
Death to droppers! :P
socksey
Never name a pig you plan to eat. - unknown
As I said in another thread (named "I am not welcome"), it must be clear that now it's *me* the one who is blocked, NOT MY IP ADDRESS.
I could register a new username and log in with it with NO PROBLEMS.
Then I reconnected using AramKhan and I have been disconnected with a message stating "you aren't welcome".
So please let's not mix up things.
I never tried to reconnect again, since being not welcome on FIBS is not such a drama for me.
I understand that many players prefer to ignore that, as the Niemoller letter fits well in many situations, and this make no exception: you are afraid to disappoint Patti, and most of the times you seem to be walking on eggs trying not to break them.
My "problem" is that I don't consider FIBS worth the loss of my freedom of speech.
And I think it's coward to hide my ban, trying to mask it as a general italian ban.
If Patti has been offended by my previous posts she should have had the courage to say "I don't like what you said so you won't play on my own server", as I recognize her the right to do whatever she likes on her private ownings.
You all know that it works this way, otherwise you would not be trying to be kind to her whatever she does.
It's a sort of compromise I don't like.
That's all.