Another reason to OCCUPY DC

[NIHILIST]

Several weeks ago, when the OCCUPY WALL STREET movement was in its prime, I opined that the protesters would be more accurate if they directed their rage at the government rather than the financial community. WRONG, said such expert economists as garp and Patti Beadles, it was all those greedy, predatory bankers who caused the economic meltdown.

Then, today, this news hits:


The Treasury Department approved pay packages worth $5 million or more for 49 executives at a handful of firms that received the biggest taxpayer bailouts between 2009 and 2011.

A scathing new audit this week by the inspector general for the Troubled Asset Relief Program blasted those payments, all of which occurred despite a $500,000 salary cap that President Obama and Congress established in 2009 at firms receiving "exceptional assistance" under TARP.

Treasury Department and Federal Reserve Bank of New York officials joined behind the scenes with the bailed-out firms to repeatedly pressure Kenneth Feinberg, the special federal master overseeing the compensation packages, to approve higher salaries, the audit found. Feinberg had the power to allow waivers to the cash cap, but the report found the program's contradictory goals meant "he could not effectively rein in excessive compensation."

The CEO of one bailed-out firm, Ally Financial, actually complained that one of his underlings, who was paying for private school for his kids, would be "cash poor" if relegated to a salary of just $500,000.

The audit looked at seven of the biggest TARP recipients — Citigroup, Bank of America, AIG, General Motors, Ally, Chrysler, and Chrysler Financial.

AIG repeatedly insisted on the biggest pay packages and represented 80% of Feinberg's "headaches," the audit said. The company received more than $180 billion in federal bailout money in 2008, and even today, after paying back billions, it is still 70% owned by the federal government.

But at the recession's height in spring 2009, AIG had the audacity to press Feinberg for raises ranging from 20% to 550% for its top employees, the report said.
Backed by top Treasury aides, AIG argued that unless it got those raises, key people would leave and the government would not get its money back.

What's more, AIG wanted those salaries in cash, not stock. Company execs confided to Feinberg that the firm's common stock was "essentially worthless," the report said.

To his credit, Feinberg resisted the most outrageous salary demands, but he still approved dozens above the government's $500,000 cash cap.
In 2009, for instance, he approved a $10.5 million package for AIG chief executive Robert Benmosch, which included $3 million in cash.

The following year, Feinberg approved another $10.5 million for Benmosch, while signing off on packages of from $3 million to $7.6 million for 17 of AIG's 22 top employees.

Ally CEO Michael Carpenter got approval for an $8.1 million package. General Motors chief Fritz Henderson got $5.1 million.



To make this laughable as well as sickening, Hussein has been on the campaign trail insisting that the only way to solve the country's economic woes is to raise income taxes on those making $ 1 million or more, to get them to pay their " fair share."

Another bit of news out today is that the government still can't seem to pick winners while trying its hardest at social re-engineering.

The parent company of an electric car battery maker that received a $118 million grant from the Obama administration filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection on Thursday.

New York-based Ener1 said it has been affected by competition from China and other countries.

Ener1 subsidiary EnerDel received a $118 million stimulus grant from the Energy Department in 2009, and Vice President Joe Biden visited the company's new battery plant in Indiana last year.

Ener1 is the third company to seek bankruptcy protection after receiving assistance from the Energy Department under the economic stimulus law. California solar panel maker Solyndra Inc. and Beacon Power, a Massachusetts energy-storage firm, declared bankruptcy last year. Solyndra received a $528 million federal loan, while Beacon Power got a $43 million loan guarantee.

Would it surprise anyone if it turned out that these beneficiaries of federal largesse turned out to be financial supporters of Hussein & Co ?

Bob

[moonshadow]

To make this laughable as well as sickening, Hussein has been on the campaign trail insisting that the only way to solve the country's economic woes is to raise income taxes on those making $ 1 million or more, to get them to pay their " fair share."

The blatant hypocrisy of President Obama on this particular issue is one of the reasons I find most liberals to be intellectual frauds in that they find ways to exempt themselves and their cronies from what they themselves wish to impose on others.

It was just released by the IRS that 36 aides on President Obama's executive staff have delinquent federal taxes amounting to $833,970.  http://news.investors.com/Article/599002/201201260818/obama-white-house-staff-back-taxes.htm

By most US wage earners standards these aides are handsomely paid and 'rich'. Also, most of them are government parasites by nature and they essentially contribute nothing to the economy, which begs the question of exactly what are they doing? (Probably I do not want to know.)

So why the hell isn't President Barak firing his own staff members who haven't paid their fair share?

Occupy DC and don't forget to Occupy the Oval Orfice as well.   

[PersianLord]

Well said, folks.

As I pointed out before, the biggest supporters and financiers of the interventionist agenda are, quite contrary to what you might think, the very jerks who appear (or want you to think so) to be the main losers of a Reddish revolution; the richest pigs.  Just read history and check for yourself which bastards financed the October Revolution of 1917 in Russia. Which financial vampires met Vladimir Ilyich Lenin when he was in exile and promised to financially support him?!

The reason behind the backing of insidious leftist/big government agenda by the big bankers/businessmen is really simple: They hate competition! and they just want to set up a puppet government to exclusively take care of their fortune and vicious financial empires; all achieved by exploiting the naive populist movements. Basically, they find a bunch of idle, lazy, desperate and whining hippies, inject excessive doses of hopium into their empty heads, fund them and send them to streets and use them as a highly effective pressure leverage in their bargains behind the scenes to gain an even more unfair advantage against their competitors.

And the worst part is that these jerks control both the finance and the media. So they can manipulate the masses in every way they wish to. This is why a noble and honest person like Ron Paul has been marginalized by the main stream media while he has been enjoying a great reputation among the libertarian section of the Republican party and instead a $10 whore like Gingrich has gained so much popularity recently. It is all engineered and you know why? Because Ron Paul is advocating to abolish that damned snake-pit which has swindled basically all the world by printing money out of thin air: The privately-run Federal Reserve of the United States of America. (It is not a bad idea also to check the ethnic origins of the chairmen of Federal Reserves from 1913 till now and compare it with the ethnic origins of mega bankers who financed the October Revolution and then to the prominent figures in the first Comintern and members of the first communist party that ruled Russia after the revolution - and why not to Marx himself?! - and you'll find a very interesting pattern: diversity at maximum! - but hey, I am sure that Professor Dorbel thinks this is all random, as random as FIBS dice, and since he is always correct, I also think this is all random; no more debate needed.)

Too bad the naive leftist idiots don't realize that only through a free, competitive and audited (audit and supervision yes, intervention and manipulation no) market economy can the society achieve prosperity, justice and advancement for all of its members, not just a few Chosen.

PL

[dorbel]

Disgusting. Wading through PL's rants we find much that could, possibly even has, come straight from the pages of Mein Kampf, except that unlike Adolf PL lacks the integrity to name his targets clearly. Can we look forward to a recap of the Zinoviev letter in the near future? Are The Protocols of Zion about to make a re-appearance as evidence of the great conspiracy?

[PersianLord]

Ah, our dear Professor has chimed in to illuminate us all, again!

What a blessing indeed, because his usual accusations of me being a Nazi prompted me to find my post in the other thread about the fact that financial supporters of Nazis were also big bankers/businessmen who shared with the leftists their hatred of free competition:

« Reply #98 on: January 12, 2012, 08:26:28 AM »
Quote
With great appreciation of Moonshadow's post, I just wanted to add that fans of big government and big businesses are usually guided and supported from the same heinous forces behind the scenes, even though they might appear to be arch enemies in the public eyes. For instance, won't you be surprised to know that the main financiers of the Russian Revolution in 1917 were some mega-bankers of Europe and U.S.?! The same can be said about Adolph Hitler and his Nazi movement; again big businesses were funding him covertly.

http://www.fibsboard.com/politics-religion/buy-usd-and-tbs/msg29269/#msg29269

I see a lot of similarities between all kinds of socialist movements; whether they are of the Proletariat origins or from the Nationalist stock: they all hate economic freedom!

In the end, I quote here an illuminating piece from Thomas Jefferson about the perils and hazards of an out-of-control banking system towards the freedom and liberty rights of the people:

I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around [the banks] will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered. The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs."

PL

[stiefnu]

I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around [the banks] will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered. The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs."

What an excellent quote!  The sooner governments wrest back control of their (our) currencies, from rampant capitalist banks and corporations, the better off we shall all be.

Steve

[NIHILIST]

I believe that Jefferson, at the time, was involved in an ongoing debate with Alexander Hamilton and the Federalists over the banking issue. These two remarkable men couldn't have been more different politically.

Jefferson had spent a considerable amount of time in France and witnessed firsthand the collapse of the monarchy. His great fear was that a powerful central government was akin to a monarchy and so was a strong proponent of states rights.

Hamilton, by contrast, was a strong proponent of Federalism, ie a strong central government. He felt that this type of government was necessary to create strong institutions and policies to benefit the entire nation, not just a few select states. Among these was a central bank. Hamilton became the first Secretary of the Treasury under Washington.

Jefferson went on to serve two terms as our third president. His most notable accomplishments were the purchase of the Louisiana territory from Nsapoleon and the commission of the Corps Of Discovery to explore the new territory.

In a highly ironic twist of fate Hamilton was killed in a duel by Aaron Burr, who had been the first Vice President of............THOMAS JEFFERSON.

The issue of a central bank, The Bank of The United States, festered until President Andrew Jackson, himself no stranger to duels, opposed its re-charter and the bank died a quiet death.


Bob

[diane]

The reason behind the backing of insidious leftist/big government agenda by the big bankers/businessmen is really simple: They hate competition! and they just want to set up a puppet government to exclusively take care of their fortune and vicious financial empires;

Isn't this exactly what I said all along..with the one exception - a genuine leftist government would never back this kind of action - it is entirely what they stand against. Sadly - a genuine leftist government cannot get near power, because the puppets get all the campaign money, media backing and exposure required to get the sheep to vote for them.

So - who is most to blame here..the capitalist puppets of the vicious financial empires...or the people who do not see through the rhetoric and wrapping to the truth...that big business men have no scruples whatsoever and no interest in making anything better for anyone except themselves - and if anyone is poisoned, starving or otherwise killed along the way, well..you cant make an omelet without breaking eggs..can you.

The occupy movement is equally against the vicious financial empires and their puppets..but if you want to bring down the puppets - you don't go after the puppet..you go after the puppet master.

[PersianLord]

Isn't this exactly what I said all along..with the one exception - a genuine leftist government would never back this kind of action - it is entirely what they stand against. Sadly - a genuine leftist government cannot get near power, because the puppets get all the campaign money, media backing and exposure required to get the sheep to vote for them.

So - who is most to blame here..the capitalist puppets of the vicious financial empires...or the people who do not see through the rhetoric and wrapping to the truth...that big business men have no scruples whatsoever and no interest in making anything better for anyone except themselves - and if anyone is poisoned, starving or otherwise killed along the way, well..you cant make an omelet without breaking eggs..can you.

The occupy movement is equally against the vicious financial empires and their puppets..but if you want to bring down the puppets - you don't go after the puppet..you go after the puppet master.

As I stated in the other thread, the problem with leftists is not their goals, it is their 'stratagem' that makes me sick. I share with you the enmity towards the greedy bankers who have screwed up almost everything in the human societies almost everywhere in the world, but my plans to end this tyranny is very different.

I see the banking problems as a kind of cancerous tumor grown up in a body - a mere bug in the system - and not an independent organism of their own. You don't destroy the whole body/system to cure the cancer/bug, do you?! These bankers are just parasites and the way to deal with them should be the same when we deal with parasites in our homes: making the environment unsafe and unattractive for them by removing the dirt and rotten foods and if necessary by using pesticides. We don't have to demolish the whole house to kill the parasites living inside. Similarly, we don't need to destroy the whole capitalist system just to cure the banking problem.

PL

[diane]

I am going to have one go at showing PL where his logic is so completely flawed as to be incomprehensible..then not revisit this, as it like debating with a 4 year old.

The reason behind the backing of insidious leftist/big government agenda by the big bankers/businessmen is really simple: They hate competition!

So...from this point on 'they' are the bankers/businessmen..

and they just want to set up a puppet government to exclusively take care of their fortune and vicious financial empires;

So they are controlling the government - gotcha - exactly my dissatisfaction with the world as it is.

all achieved by exploiting the naive populist movements. Basically, they find a bunch of idle, lazy, desperate and whining hippies, inject excessive doses of hopium into their empty heads, fund them and send them to streets and use them as a highly effective pressure leverage in their bargains behind the scenes to gain an even more unfair advantage against their competitors.

couldnt agree more, there is NOTHING the free market wont stoop too when they get those dollar signs in their eyes. So we have drugging people, using people, manipulating media, spending money to get an advantage any way they can..sure - they really really are the scum of the earth, aren't they. The sooner they are naturally selected out of the gene pool, the better [I do hope their wives are screwing around - ideally with those hippies who have all day to devote to spoiling a lady, and hey, maybe even cleaning the pool  ][/quote]

And the worst part is that these jerks control both the finance and the media. So they can manipulate the masses in every way they wish to.

Yes - disgusting isnt it - if you are rich, powerful and have fewer scruples than a sack of vipers, it is amazing what you will do to make sure you come out on top.

Sadly, it is the next bit where you undo all that logical reasoning you just cited.....you start with all the right information, come so close to putting it together correctly - but then just lose it at the last minute..I do urge you to try again....

This is why a noble and honest person like Ron Paul has been marginalized by the main stream media while he has been enjoying a great reputation among the libertarian section of the Republican party and instead a $10 whore like Gingrich has gained so much popularity recently. It is all engineered and you know why?

Well - you covered that earlier..the rich and powerful who are the only ones who CAN control the media, have chosen to do so - guess they didnt like the competiton.

Because Ron Paul is advocating to abolish that damned snake-pit which has swindled basically all the world by printing money out of thin air: The privately-run Federal Reserve of the United States of America.

If they stop printing imaginary money..who will buy their products?? The homeless, jobless, masses - swindled out of jobs, pensions, insurance etc? They have nothing left to spend - and if your populace cant spend - how do you make money? Think about it.

(It is not a bad idea also to check the ethnic origins of the chairmen of Federal Reserves from 1913 till now and compare it with the ethnic origins of mega bankers who financed the October Revolution and then to the prominent figures in the first Comintern and members of the first communist party that ruled Russia after the revolution - and why not to Marx himself?! - and you'll find a very interesting pattern: diversity at maximum! - but hey, I am sure that Professor Dorbel thinks this is all random, as random as FIBS dice, and since he is always correct, I also think this is all random; no more debate needed.)

Nothing to say there..that is just your own vessel of hatred spilling over...ignoring that, and moving back on to your hypothesis...

Too bad the naive leftist idiots don't realize that only through a free, competitive and audited (audit and supervision yes, intervention and manipulation no) market economy can the society achieve prosperity, justice and advancement for all of its members, not just a few Chosen.

Your entire post describes how the bankers and businessmen are manipulating everything to get what they want. The media, the government, the people, the voters - hell even the amount of money floating around. What power on earth do you think will be able to honestly, fairly and thoroughly audit and supervise them??

They will not succumb to that, not ever...if you are purporting that a rival company will introduce fair competition and drive costs down and make a better world for everyone...take off those rose coloured glasses at once...think more 'mob mentality'..the ones who will win the market are quite simply the ones who will stoop the lowest to make their bucks...and that will involve suffering for all of humanity - in their native countries and any other they choose to involve.

Does that sound familiar - oh wait, yes it does - that is Exactly where we are - the natural outcome of a market calling the shots - and not any government at all..they were just busy doing as they were told and perhaps making the people think they were getting their own way just enough to avoid a civil war.

[PersianLord]

Diane, ignoring your flaming rhetoric, the main point of your long post is this:

Does that sound familiar - oh wait, yes it does - that is Exactly where we are - the natural outcome of a market calling the shots - and not any government at all

This is the only place, apparently, that we part ways, because according to your own words, you endorse my analysis of the mechanism and incentives behind the modern big governments running modern human societies: the mega bankers and businessmen wanting to stifle competition. Cheers.

Now answer my question: How on earth did you come into that conclusion that the corrupt governments and rotten banking system of our 21-century societies are the natural outcome of the free market economy?!

To me, as I have stated in my previous posts, this problem is just a cancerous tumor/bug in the human body/system. It can get fixed.

And now wait and listen to me as I unfold your truly disgusting flawed logic and hypocrisy:

You're proposing that the corrupt governments and the banking scam problem is a natural outcome of the free market system and thus, the whole system must be destroyed, but when you are asked that what alternatives you'd come up with to replace this market economy, a genuine leftist government keeps popping up in your intellectual catharsis here.

Now I am asking: how do you dare to describe the banking scam as a natural outcome of free market economy, while ignoring the colossal amount of human suffering and miseries under the leftist governments?! How can you see yourself in a position to discard the atrocities of the Stalin, Mao, Paul Bot, Kim animals and the rest of leftist vampires as mere misdeeds of ingenuine leftist governments and furthering your agenda of a setting up a genuine leftist government and at the same time describing the banking fraud as a natural outcome of the free market and thus, depriving the adherents of free market economies of the right to diagnosis this infection as a mere fixable bug in the system?! How's that the disgusting poverty and misery of the N. Korean people, and all the peoples under the tyrannic leftist yoke, is not the natural outcome of a socialist regime?! How many times humans should suffer horribly under the tyrannic yoke of leftist regimes to convince you that there might be a systematic flaw in your political philosophy?!

If this is not sheer hypocrisy, then what it is?

PL

PS:

I am not saying that free market economy is the best system that satisfies my ideal definition of a human society economically, but it's the least worst and history has proven multiple times that we have no better alternatives at hand at the current moment to replace it. BTW, if Diane and his omniscient compatriot ever come to invent a new, proven system that works better than capitalism, ping me at: PL@STFU.com

Regards,

[NIHILIST]

In July 2008, then candidate Obama excoriated G W Bush for a huge rise in the national debt during his eight year watch.


"The problem is that the way Bush has done it in the last eight years is to take out a credit card from the Bank of China in the name of our children, driving up our national debt from $5 trillion from the first 42 presidents. No. 43 added $4 trillion by his lonesome. So we now have over $9 trillion of debt that we are going to have to pay back. $30,000 for every man woman and child. That's irresponsible, that's unpatriotic," Obama said.


Under Hussein's three year watch the debt has reached $ 16 trillion, thats more than $ 50,000 for every man, woman and child. If Bush's actions were unpatriotic, Hussein's are downright treasonous.


Bob